Do you think Billy Ray should teach me the Gladstone Technique and/or any other good grip technique?
Yes!
0%
( 0 )
Absolutely!!
20%
( 1 )
Hell yeah!!!
80%
( 4 )
Total Votes : 5
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Alan_ groove master
Posts: 2127
Joined: 30 Dec 2007
Location: austin, tx
I would NOT wrap my index finger around the stick like that. Also, the looser your hands are, the faster you can go.
I change the balance point on my grip depending on volume. when playing soft, it tends to balance around the index finger to allow full use of the other fingers for fast articulation. with more volume, it moves back toward the other fingers a tad.
I thought the finger hook thing looked funny! So when playing loud, is your fulcrum at your thumb and middle finger? I remember Billy Ray mentioned something about having the fulcrum near the back of the hand but I have no idea what he was talking about.
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Fri May 09, 2008 6:13 pm
SGarrett Moderator
Posts: 3926
Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Location: Near Sacramento, CA
Take your index finger and completely relax it, holding more with your pinky and ring fingers. Yes, put your pinky on the stick unless you're having a cup of English tea.
Here are some pictures of my grip with a VicFirth Harvey Mason.
This is open. Note that my pinky is still in contact with the stick and that my index finger is not wrapped around. This looks a little tense because I'm holding the stick in position for the picture.
This one is closed. Once again note the index and pinky fingers along with how much of the stick is past my fingers. If I'm playing heavy, I move the butt end so it's flush with my pinky to put more weight at the front of the stick for a greater throw.
Top view, other hand.
And here's a pretty cheese-ball video I made. No sound and I was holding the camera myself, but it's a quick demonstration. Pay attention to the space between my thumb and index finger. Near the end I'll actually pull my index finger completely off, to show that it's mostly just a guide for this. Also, notice how little I actually move my hand to get the rebound. Once you're at whichever position you want, just squeeze your fingers closed for the second note. The stick is a VicFirth 7A.
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it says let the sticks fly!!! Send em flyin!!!
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Fri May 09, 2008 11:51 pm
Funk pipe beginner
Posts: 33
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Location: London, UK
Multibomber wrote:
yes yes!! please do!!
Here ya go, hope these are detailed enough for ya...
Notice how the stick rests on the tips of my fingers only, the fulcrum is between my thumb and the first joint (nearest the tip) of my index finger and the tip of my middle finger, also the webbing between thumb and index is very open. I can move my thumb back a wee bit so it's opposite the middle finger and then take my index finger off completely, which moves the fulcrum toward the back of the fingers, this gives a very loose grip which is great for singles...but I'm not too comfortable with it as yet.
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Sat May 10, 2008 3:46 am
Quarter Note beginner
Posts: 45
Joined: 09 May 2008
Multibomber wrote:
I thought the finger hook thing looked funny! So when playing loud, is your fulcrum at your thumb and middle finger? I remember Billy Ray mentioned something about having the fulcrum near the back of the hand but I have no idea what he was talking about.
I would say that comment would refer to using the MOELLER method - with the fulcrum moving more to the back of the hand. See the Jim Chapins Video for more detail/explanation.
Sat May 10, 2008 4:18 pm
Funk pipe beginner
Posts: 33
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Location: London, UK
It's not just used for the moeller technique, I went to a Dave Weckl masterclass as few months ago and he was talking a lot about that type of grip, he now uses it all the time on his right hand (he's traditional) so he uses it for everything, he does use a lot of moeller in his playing though. He also said how years of not using the freestroke gave him arthritis in his wrists/hands!
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Mon May 12, 2008 8:28 am
Homki890 session drummer
Posts: 547
Joined: 15 Oct 2006
Location: Mo'town
It's known in rudimental circles as the Trifulcrum, because the fulcrum point seems to split between the index and middle finger. While a very good grip, because of the loose nature while being very in control of the stick and also for being very relaxed, it is absolutely horrible for Tenor playing, because of the nature of crossovers and sweeps.
I don't use it very often. I stick to my tenor grip pretty well.
Homki890
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Mon May 12, 2008 8:55 am
xdoseonex groove master
Posts: 3558
Joined: 28 Dec 2006
Location: New York
well the bounce test isnt working because you have to get the stick started before you bounce it. when you hitting a drum your putting that initial motion into it. same with dribbling a basketball.
it seems like you might be winding up a bit when your doing the freestroke. remember its a strictly downward motion, and the stick will come back up.
as for the stick pulling on your finger, maybe you should be incorperating your other fingers?
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Mon May 12, 2008 9:29 am
Multibomber drumming adept
Posts: 234
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
FUNK PIPE and SGARRETT
The pics and vids were a HUUUUUUUUGGGGEEEEE help! Thanks a lot, I'm already getting better! And Funk Pipe, can you try to explain a little more about what Dave Weckl was saying??
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Wed May 14, 2008 1:13 am
Funk pipe beginner
Posts: 33
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Location: London, UK
Well he talked about how in ther 80's and 90's he didn't really use the freestroke much (I'm not sure exactly when he started using it), and years and years of playing with a tight grip gave him pretty bad arthritis in his left wrist/hand, it's fine when he's playing but as soon as he stops it can get extremely painful, poor guy!
Anywho here's a vid of him talking about the freestroke, he goes on to talk about the index/middle/thumb grip...
The grip he's talking about here is the same as mine, but his index finger seems a lot looser. When I saw him a few months ago it looked like his index finger was barely in contact with the stick at all!
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Thu May 15, 2008 6:58 am
SGarrett Moderator
Posts: 3926
Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Location: Near Sacramento, CA
Ah, we used to watch that video all the time. Not talking trash here, but there are a great number of drummers around here who need to watch that and pay attention.
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Dr. Rodney McKay wrote:
Well, I only know one thing and that is that flying darkness that eats energy can only be very, very bad.
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