Recently my band welcomed a new bass player. I must admint that although it sounds weird this is the first bass player that really listens to what I'm doing on the drums and plays with my bass drum not against it. As much as I love this the other bandmates think that although we've gained a better sound (the old bass man was a rather crappy player who used up ALL the space in a song) we've lost a lot of 'power' in our sound. It is rather hard to explain because to me it is that feeling you get when everything is just so right that it is really hard to stop yourself from smiling - everyone plays what they're supposed to play, the dynamics are perfect and you're all sharing the same groove.
The problem is that the guitar player insists on me playing harder then I was so I'm REALLY hitting hard - last rehersal I played rimshots on my toms and damaged my sticks from using rimclicks... and still the guitar player was unsatisfied and insisted that I play with little attack. Now, for me this is a very strange situation because from what I undestand drums are an acoustic instrument and they can sound ONLY THAT LOUD.
Is there something that I'm missing (I'm 99% sure that I've been playing with the same attitude, dynamic level etc for a quite some time now) by thinking that the problem could be not with my playing but it is a result of the new bass player playing in an uncertain way due to the fact that a lot of the material is really new to him?
Any thoughts welcome.








_________________
Rhytm is a way to transmit a description of experience
in an emotional and not abstract way.
It is more than a metaphor:
It is a physical experience as real as any other.

first off, congrats on the addition to your band. it seems like you all are very pleased with what he's brought to the table.

if you guys are practicing, volume is only really an issue in the sense that you all need to hear whats being played. at a show, if you're not loud enough, the sound guy will do the work for you. you wont have to change your playing. and also, if the guitar is too loud, the sound guy will take care of that too. at practices, you only need to be loud enough to make sure you can hear each other and the parts are tight. at a show, you set up and the sound guy will do the rest.

very cool. its alway snice to play with a bass player who really locks in, it makes it so much more fun to play. tell the guitar player to turn down, and get over it, me i dont let others tell me how to hit my drums,they dont play drums and dont know. and i am not goin to damage my equipment cause they over do volume.








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Get KRUNK...Its A Death Metal Thing.

First off the drums and Bass locking together is the key.

If you are all in the discussion including the bass player talk about how your songs are sounding in terms of Feel, Sound and function.

Try talking to the Bass Player as he is new to your situation. Describe how the Band wants the stuff to sound.

In some situations it's good to follow the drummer and in other parts of the song he can change up to play a rythm type of Bass Line. All formula's are to be thought in the songwriting process.

It's best for you and the Bass Player to figure out what the needs o the song are. In the sametime you can't let the locking up go away. I'm not sure what type of music you are playing as to give my input on how the Bass n drums should construct the foundation.

I have tons of experience working with different types of music From Progressive, Metal, Glam, Pop, Rock, Fusion and so forth so if I can help feel free to contact me sjdrummerboy@yahoo.com.

Hope this helps.

I was in a band that went through tons of member changes. If the only thing that's changed is the bassist, then that's where the problem is. The new guy isn't comfortable with the material yet and I'm betting his gear isn't the same either so that'll play a huge role in the sound. Once he gets more comfortable with the material and plays it like he owns it, everything should be back to normal for the most part. You might have to make him play a couple parts here-and-there exactly like your first bassist to get the same feel, and he should understand that.

Don't abuse your stuff, it's not worth it. Try explaining things to the rest of the band in a non confrontational way outside of the practice room. Like call them up and say, "Dude, I just realized something..." and explain it. They should understand. If they don't... I don't know what to tell you other than don't abuse your stuff and if you're willing, get some bigger drums and cymbals to fill more "dead space".








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8-piece Mapex Vx
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Qbs wrote:

The problem is that the guitar player insists on me playing harder then I was so I'm REALLY hitting hard - last rehersal I played rimshots on my toms and damaged my sticks from using rimclicks... and still the guitar player was unsatisfied and insisted that I play with little attack.

Sounds like your guitarist might be a victim of high stage volume. You know, where everyone tries to get their volume over everyone else, it's a bad situation because soon the sound become muddy and no one can hear anyone else. If you are hitting real hard and backing up your cymbal hits with a kick or a snare, he should be at a level or a monitor level where he can hear you.

- Pete








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Don't worry about the petty things, just pet the sweaty things

Any time you add a new member they will bring a different characteristic to the sound. If you want to go back to that "old sound" then the other player is going to be the guy to use.

As to you playing harder than you should, I think you ought not strain yourself. Perhaps you sit a little farther ahead of the beat to compensate, but you'll lose that nice cool groove you have going with your new bandmate.

Like Ray Charles said "It gonna do what it do"....that's pretty much what you have to work with. As long as your band sounds good, why worry?

And to the guitar player- tell him the band is becoming "seasoned".








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13612
www.billraydrums.com
www.myspace.com/billraydrums

Thanks for all the feedback guys.
I talked with my band and they insist that they now understand that volume is not the problem - I've said that I can put microphones on my drums for the rehearsals nad prove to them that it doesn't work that way. They, especially the guitar player, insist that I have a problem with dynamical playing and with getting the right feel for the song. Well... I don't need to brag about it but I've been told many times by more experienced musicians that they like how consistent my playing is especially as far as dynamics go. Of course I am aware of my flaws and I'm constantly working to be a better drummer but it really gets frustrating when you're playing the same song over and over again with what I believe is the same ammount of feel, power etc. put in into it and once the band is satisfied with it and then they're not. I'm really not trying to make any excuses but I believe that as long as everyone in the band is not comfortable with the song and cannot play it at 100% the drummer will never compensate for that. Especially if the bass player lowers his volume because he's still composing his part.
And another thing - the guitar player insists that I loose a lot of the 'good vibe' by playing with a metronome. I really am speechles when I hear such crap beacuse IMHO it's better to be able to play with a click than without one. Plus I feel more comfortable when a machine does the counting for me

Sorry to be nagging guys but this problem is bugging me for some time now and I want to get some opinions from other drummer.
For the record - I play reggae with my band.








_________________
Rhytm is a way to transmit a description of experience
in an emotional and not abstract way.
It is more than a metaphor:
It is a physical experience as real as any other.

Qbs wrote:

Thanks for all the feedback guys.
I talked with my band and they insist that they now understand that volume is not the problem - I've said that I can put microphones on my drums for the rehearsals nad prove to them that it doesn't work that way. They, especially the guitar player, insist that I have a problem with dynamical playing and with getting the right feel for the song. Well... I don't need to brag about it but I've been told many times by more experienced musicians that they like how consistent my playing is especially as far as dynamics go. Of course I am aware of my flaws and I'm constantly working to be a better drummer but it really gets frustrating when you're playing the same song over and over again with what I believe is the same ammount of feel, power etc. put in into it and once the band is satisfied with it and then they're not. I'm really not trying to make any excuses but I believe that as long as everyone in the band is not comfortable with the song and cannot play it at 100% the drummer will never compensate for that. Especially if the bass player lowers his volume because he's still composing his part.
And another thing - the guitar player insists that I loose a lot of the 'good vibe' by playing with a metronome. I really am speechles when I hear such crap beacuse IMHO it's better to be able to play with a click than without one. Plus I feel more comfortable when a machine does the counting for me

Sorry to be nagging guys but this problem is bugging me for some time now and I want to get some opinions from other drummer.
For the record - I play reggae with my band.

Bottom line is this- You, Mr. Drummer are a commodity. Should you leave for "greener pastures" I'm sure that those guys would find another drummer but let me tell you that should you get into the working pool of guys and prove yourself worthy, Your phone will ring of the hook.

That being said, having "metronomically perfect time" is good, but it does not constitute "feel". Even the act of "thinking edgier" can add an element of feeling to your playing.

There's a million guitarists....GOOD drummers are worth alot.








_________________
13612
www.billraydrums.com
www.myspace.com/billraydrums

That's another thing... since the new bass player came I have a feeling he's been trying to discredit me in front of the band and whenever an opportunity arises he'll say something like "my brother (he's brother is a drummer) would play this like that..."

As far as 'feel' goes I am aware that playing straight is not everything especially in reggae when there is that kind of swung feel, than again we're preparing to record our debut album and we'll be recording with a metronome so I recon that we need all the practice we can get. Also, I was always told by other drummers that it's better to be able to play with a metronome and have the option to choose to play without it rather then just not being able to play with a metronome.

Oh and another thing to me playing with the right 'feel' comes from getting the song down as far as muscle memory - when I don't have to think about what to hit next then I can play as loose as possible and to me that is when I play with the best 'feel'








_________________
Rhytm is a way to transmit a description of experience
in an emotional and not abstract way.
It is more than a metaphor:
It is a physical experience as real as any other.